eBay Store - HuH?

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eBay Store - HuH?

E.A. Davison & Lisa Pastille

Published March 19, 2006

Subject: Thanks for your terrific response
From: Lisa Pastille
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2006

Dear Betsy,

I gotta say...I'm impressed with a company whose President "gets their hands dirty" and actually speaks to the little people. It says a lot about your operation. Thank you for taking the time to answer me.

Let me share with you my response to the ebay offer to artists. I'm not an ebay junkie so it could be that I just don't understand the whole thing. However, it seems to me that, in effect, an artist's piece ultimately gets sold to the lowest bidder rather than the highest bidder. Consider this; an artist places a real world price figure on their piece. No one goes for it. Why? Because most items on that web site are way, way below a real world figure and that's the whole premise of ebay. Great stuff for cheap, no? So what does the artist do? They start the bidding at a super low price to accommodate the web site's unspoken premise and the site's "viewership". The art is ultimately compromised. In the end the artist is the one who doesn't make out. Don't get me wrong. It would be a great situation under other circumstances like selling stuff you'd take to Salvation Army or anything else that would otherwise be sitting in the attic collecting dust. Where am I going wrong here? The scenario I give seems too obvious to me so I figure I must have it wrong. Help.

If in fact, I don't have it wrong, wouldn't it be great if there is something like a "Sotheby's" for the common folk where the art pieces go for a more reasonable real world price as an opening bid. The buyers would be people who respect art in all its forms and would be willing to pay reasonable prices that would be cheaper than going into a gallery to buy but more expensive than anything you'd see on ebay. I don't know. There may be something out there that already exists but it seems that ebay is more trouble than it's worth. I went to the site to see the different kinds of art work. OK, some of it is not my style and I don't see the appeal. For instance, I saw a huge multi panel wall unit which was hand painted and it's going bid is $11!! It costs $35 just to ship it. My God, that's a travesty!!! Talk about an insult! Someone painted their heart out to do that piece and they're only getting $11!! Is this really the environment that the artists on your web site want to try and sell their stuff? The Mind's Island site is a class act and getting better. So when I go over to the ebay site it just seems like I dropped 100 floors of "class" and entered a place where toy hats and used tire wheels are being sold. I don't want to insult ebay because it really is a cool place to get stuff but I just don't see that the environment is respectable enough for "works of the spirit". It's like trying to sell fillet mignon at a Wendy's. Tell me where I'm going wrong.
OK, this is long enough. Thanks, again, for the opportunity to share this stuff. I think Mind's Island is terrific and I'm glad to be a part of it. We're all works in progress and, so too, is this site. It's great not to be alone in the journey.
Sincerely, Lisa

Subject: Conversations with Lisa :-)
From: Betsy Davison Betsy@MindsIsland.com
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2006

Hi Lisa,

Again, thank you for taking the time to send us your thoughts on our newest eBay service and how that may affect who and what Minds Island will become. Yes, we are definitely on a journey - as we grow our goal is to continue to provide excellent service and keep in contact with each one of our members. I can tell you that the Internet is cold and impersonal enough. Our job will be to keep close to the artists and make sure we are headed in the right direction. We have to take chances but when we do, our intent is to go in the direction of offering our artists exposure beyond their local geography, gain traffic, potential clients and ideally - sales.

We want to stay professional and a class act so let me address the reasons why we chose to offer this new service and how eBay stores are treated differently than eBay.com. I have had Dawn, our resident in-house expert on eBay take a look at your email below and much of her input is included in my response.

First, I think you went to ebay.com which in fact does have a bit of a reputation as more of a flea market. There is a huge difference between the auctions on eBay.com and a private eBay store. The new service we are offering is the ability to enter your art item into our store and the price you set for the artwork is the price it sells for. No bidding! Our eBay store doesn't offer you anything but one set price for goods. It's not really a "deal" site. There are stores that sell things cheaply and there are art stores that sell pieces for next to nothing. That is a travesty....I agree! This isn't the norm though. Each store is different. People can browse all of the eBay stores or they can go to just one Minds Island eBay Store.

eBay.com does have auctions and items do sell to the lowest bidder. That's why we wanted to take out a store on eBay so we could separate ourselves and have our artists showcase their work AND set the price as they saw fit. The other thing our artists are always aware of is that their work does sometimes hang on a gallery wall and you can't undercut your galleries by placing an item for sale below market price.

Why did we take on this new service? Bottom line - traffic and sales. eBay has become the largest online retail marketplace on earth! They created stores for exactly the reasons you so eloquently pointed out. Even Google is hot on their heels to come up with a counterpart to eBay.

Our thoughts: Where else would our members have an opportunity to place multiple items for view and for sale to such a broad audience? We're talking about even your local customers. You can advertise that you have works for sale and don't have to worry about taking payment or bad checks - we (and ebay) do all of that for you. Now you also get to show your work to non-traditional customers. These are people that do not live near you but maybe know someone who has mentioned your work or people who would never in their life have heard of you but stumble upon your work because they're searching for canvas paintings of homes in Umbria on the web or on eBay (by the way I was in Tuscany in October and I love this piece).

We are updating our site so that if you post artwork for sale in our eBay store, there will be a button that appears next to that art image in your Minds Island Studio that says "buy it on eBay". This is one more way for our artists to take payment through their Minds Island Studio without having to pay for a merchant account (very expensive). We will also be adding a PayPal button to your studio so you can take payment for one of your items via paypal directly thru your studio.

My goodness, now I'm writing a book! I think I'm going to copy and paste our conversations and make it into an article on the site so others can join in with comments. Blogging will be the next service we introduce so we can invite many others to join in this conversation!

In the end, it is our job to bridge the gap between marketing and selling your work in the traditional fashion and marketing and 'selling' your work on the Internet (I use quotations around 'selling' as we never guarantee that we will sell your work). I find that being 'alone' with your own website on the Internet is much like having your own studio for painting but you're still trying to find the right gallery to help you market your work. Somehow, the art industry just seems to work better when artists work together and not alone. Unless you're a well known artist, there won't be too many galleries that can afford to represent one artist! Thus, Minds Island vs. the bricks-n-mortar gallery. We'll keep trying new services, developing and growing to gain the most exposure, traffic and potential clients through advertising for our members and yet we won't be for everyone. It all depends on how artists view their business.

So I hope Dawn and I made sense to you and addressed so many of your good points. I see you've added another studio page to the site and it looks terrific!

Thanks and look forward to your response.
Very Best Regards,
Betsy

Subject: Conversations with Betsy :)
From: "Lisa Pastille" lpastille@msn.com
Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006

Dear Betsy,
What a great way to wake up, reading an informative and upbeat e-mail from you! I would be happy to be included in your new blogging feature (as an example of an artist who doesn't have a clue about the great things you're offering your Mind's Island clients).

I'm going to print out your e-mail and file it in my Mind's Island folder. Thanks for filling me in on all this stuff going on at eBay and Mind's Island. When I get an unhurried moment, I'll sit down and digest all that you said. I really appreciate the time you took to accumulate this info and type it into a response to me. Yes, let's not leave out Dawn.

Thanks for your compliments on my work and artist's page. Flattery gets you everywhere. It wasn't until I upgraded my membership that I was drawn back to Mind's Island to take another look at what you offer artists. As you know, some of us artists out here don't have the luxury of ONLY pursuing their art form. I have been a performing musician and singer all my life and have had to do a lot of different things to scrape together many nickels to pay the bills. I have unwittingly followed in the steps of the masters, being a modern day "starving artist". Hard knocks have their place in life. If you're smart, you learn from them as I continue to do.

My point is, because it's human nature to become complacent and distracted with things like, oh, paying the bills, for instance, I wasn't looking at Mind's Island last year when I signed up, as the practical selling tool it is. It was more of a place to direct my prospective clients to see my stuff, kind of legitimize my seriousness as an artist and also it saved me time schlepping my portfolio to each and every client. Mind's Island is great for that, not to mention the affordability, THANK YOU VERY MUCH! Upgrading really opened my eyes to the different memberships that Mind's Island offers and all the progress and changes you're making in 2006 (now who's flattering who?). You've got my attention with this upgrade and new avenues are opening in my mind as to how I can market my work. Isn't it funny... just giving a little tweak to old information can give you a new perspective on everything. It's just like the process of creating art.

Thanks for all the work you do for all of us out here. You know what they say, for every one person who speaks up, there are at least 10 more who feel the same but don't speak up, a paraphrase, obviously, but you know what I mean.

OK, motor mouth is done - for now, ha, ha. Talk to you soon, Lisa

COMMENTS

Dai Wynn ( homepage )

03/21/2006 * 20:12:19

Dear Betsy,

Lisa's comments set me thinking about selling art through the Internet.

My "day job" as an information and communications technology consultant not only concerns the technical aspects of the Internet, but also relies upon the delivery of my services electronically. My customers can be anywhere in the world - as can I. The same can be said for my part-time passion in the world of art.

But I cannot dismiss the universal perception that the Internet equates to discounted or free products and services. Mass marketing, albeit of quality products, provides little opportunity for one-on-one interaction between artist and potential purchaser. How does one add that indefinable "cachet" that is afforded by the spotlit white walls of a well-respected gallery on the ritziest tree-lined avenue in town? How does one replicate the well-publicised opening with champagne, nibbles and a chance to dress in an appropriately artistic manner? How does one offer an assurance to a nervous buyer that this as yet unknown signature will appreciate handsomely in years to come?

While I take your point that the eBay Shop is distinct from the eBay "flea market" as Lisa delightfully describes it, they are insufficiently well differentiated on my computer screen for me to feel comfortable at this time. Yes, I understand that I can set my own price, but my customer has to see value in a morass of competing works. Hopefully all this will change for the better in due course.

As you may know, I am a refugee from Artnet which chose to represent galleries rather than individual artists several years ago. They have deigned to include me on their e-letter distribution list and I quite enjoy the masochistic pleasure of reading about the (telephone number sized) prices paid at auction for a Lucian Freud or a Francis Bacon. Sotheby's and Christies are mentioned frequently.

Now, if we could just move Minds Island a tad upmarket in the direction of Sotheby's and Christies, with a healthy dose of cachet and exclusivity, while keeping membership subscriptions static, we struggling (but not necessarily "young and fresh") artists might be able to turn a slight profit on our labours of love.

Keep up the great work. Dai Wynn (downunder)

Betsy Davison ( homepage )

03/24/2006 * 16:48:23

Dear Dai

I've been at this business for 6 years now and I know I don't have all the answers for all the talented artists out there as it relates to the Internet. I think the bottom line is that the Internet is at its best an electronic business card for visual artists. Without an Internet presence, where is the visual follow-up for the client that has visited your art studio, a show, a gallery, the airport, etc.? How do they see your work again? If this wasn't the case then why would art galleries have web sites? How do galleries find new artists? How do art consultants (who compete with galleries) find art for their clients (hospitals, hotels, restaurants)? You can bet that the Internet is now routine as part of their search for talent and art. If you’re not there, then you’re not using every available tool to promote yourself and your talent.

Will the Internet ever replace the glitzy gallery opening where nervous buyers plunge into the world of buying expensive art - absolutely not! Should the Internet replace the gallery experience for the buyer - absolutely not! But galleries are not the only avenue for selling your work. Many successful artists walk the fine line between their galleries and their art consultants. Art consultants must show their clients literally 100s of images before any art shows up in person for the final decision. So the Internet is a fabulous tool for finding new and fresh art!

Here’s the direction I think the art industry is going...and believe me it's not a popular view. The Internet is empowering you as a ‘self-representing’ artist. When I was at Art Expo, New York a few weeks ago, one of the representatives of a publishing company was chatting with us. She said sales were down and the ‘hospitality’ market was incredibly competitive because clients were finding artists thru the Internet and not using the middlemen anymore. Interesting! Guess who else had a booth at Art Expo for the first time ever – eBay.

Do I think someone will find one of our artists work, pay a zillion dollars site unseen for the art and have it shipped – no. Do I think we are a practical selling tool – yes. But you have to get from “unknown” to “known”. Joining an art site such as Minds Island not only provides you with the opportunity to plug into the world-wide-web, but should work for you in adjunct to your efforts to get your art viewed in person. For example, Gina Beavers had an email last week from someone who wanted to purchase a piece from her MI studio because they had seen one of her pieces in a colleague’s home. Jodi Bonassi received a phone call from someone who had seen her art hanging in the L.A. airport after having tracked her down through her Minds Island Studio. Turns out the purchaser had seen JodiÂ’s work 8 years earlier but couldn’t afford it then. Seeing her work again in the airport reminded her of how much she liked Jodi’s work and today could afford the art so Jodi made a sale. Desiree Shafman and Martin Friedman are examples of members who sold art through our art auction last year. After the buyers received the auction items, they were so thrilled with the art that they followed up and purchased 2 more works from each artist.

......."Yes, I understand that I can set my own price, but my customer has to see value in a morass of competing works....."

I think this is why artists feel they want their own web site because they don’t want to sit next to anyone else’s art. But if you are an art gallery or art consultant constantly under pressure to find new art and new artists, wouldnÂ’t you bookmark a site like Minds Island that is constantly changing? What if the art consultant or art gallery didnÂ’t like the graphics of your personal site and just dinged it outright? You’re more likely to be revisited on a site like ours because of the draw of the other artists.

How would it be different for the customer walking down that tree lined street (think Carmel, CA) with 25 galleries to choose from? How does the customer see value in your art hanging next to all the other art in that gallery and the 24 other galleries on the street? The value is what the customer is willing to pay for that piece of art. My walls are covered with original art from over a dozen artists ranging in price from $200 to $5,000. I didn’t buy one of them because I thought they would appreciate in value. I bought them because I like them and they were all within the range of what I could afford. But let’s not mistake being part of an Internet art site and thinking we’re going to replace the need for an artist to build their path to selling work through galleries, art shows, private clients, art consultants, commissions, etc. The more your work gets out there, the better chance the value or price of your work goes up. But a “customer” has to step up to the plate to begin the journey.

So our job is to provide you with tools, traffic and potential clients in adjunct to your own efforts. We can’t just sit out here in cyberspace either. We deliberated for almost a year about whether to offer the eBay Store service to our members for exactly the reasons you and Lisa point out. Do I think eBay has a P.R. problem...yes. I think some of the points you just made is why they are introducing a new shopping feature called eBay Express to get around the “discount/rif-raf” feeling shoppers have about eBay.

Because Minds Island is exclusively an Internet company, am I willing to gamble that the traffic and potential clients from eBay are good for our members – for now, yes. It's part of the reason why we created the warehouses for our members. If you don't want anyone to "know" you are trying out the eBay store, put the image in your warehouse where no one can "see" it from the outside world. The eBay customer is pretty savvy and they are a billion strong!

For decades, retailers have been trying to figure out how to take the ‘mystery’ out of buying original fine art. If and when retailers figure this out, artists will have a field day! But for now, there are bricks and mortar galleries, pounding the pavement and the Internet. We haven’t figured it all out, but with help from our artist members we will. We will keep our site professional, on the cutting edge of technology and actually talk and listen to our members so we can continue to head in the right direction. The Internet is a pretty impersonal, lack-luster place. The art gallery experience is all about glitz and ‘warm and fuzzy’. But Minds Island prides itself on being the online ‘art gallery’ experience only we won’t hide your art in the back room, we won’t take 50% commission on sales thru your studio, and we won’t ever kick you out! We actually talk to you and value your opinion. Where else do you get to have personal calls from the president on her cell phone at all hours of the night? So keep the comments coming and by the way, I like your idea about becoming “up-market” but that’s another conversation. Thank you very much for you intelligent comment and hopefully what will become ongoing conversations! We can't do this without you. Thanks! Betsy

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